Legislature(1999 - 2000)
04/28/1999 09:06 AM Senate FIN
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
MINUTES
SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE
April 28, 1999
9:06 AM
TAPES
SFC-99 #113, Sides A and B
CALL TO ORDER
Co-Chair John Torgerson convened the meeting at
approximately 9:06 A.M.
PRESENT
In addition to Co-chair Torgerson, Senators Sean Parnell,
Randy Phillips, Dave Donley, Gary Wilken, Al Adams, Pete
Kelly and Lyda Green were present when the meeting was
convened.
Also Attending: EDDY JEANS, Manager, School Finance
Section, Department of Education; MEL KROGSENG, staff to
Senator Robin Taylor; JOHN KIMMEL, staff to Senator Robin
Taylor; BRETT HUBER, staff to Senator Rick Halford; CAROL
CARROLL, Director, Division of Support Services, Department
of Natural Resources; WALTER SAMSON, NANA Regional
Corporation; PAUL ANDERSON, Mayor pro tem, City of
Petersburg; aides to committee members and other members of
the Legislature.
Attending via Teleconference: NANCY WELCH, Regional
Manager, Northern Region Office, Division of Land,
Department of Natural Resources, Fairbanks; MAX LOWE,
President, Alaska Snowmobile Alliance, Anchorage; LANCE
STEVENS, Anchorage; BRYAN MERRELL, Anchorage; TIM
BORGSTROM, Alaska Economic Development, Anchorage; HARVEY
HARRIS, Glennallen; MICHAEL EASTHAM, Homer; DALE
BONDURANT, Kenai; HOWARD DAVIS, Kenai; TIM KRUG, Mat-Su;
TOM STAR, Mat-Su; BOB ZORICH, Petersburg; MARY FRANCIS,
Superintendent of Schools, Petersburg; SHARLA COON,
Petersburg; KAREN SEVERSON, Petersburg; ELIZABETH BACOM,
Petersburg; TRACEY REID, Petersburg; WOODY WILSON,
Superintendent of Schools, Wrangell.
SUMMARY INFORMATION
Co-chair Torgerson called the meeting to order at
approximately 9:14 a.m. He called SB 45.
SENATE BILL NO. 45
"An Act relating to tort immunity for personal
injuries or death occurring on land; relating to the
vacation by the state or a municipality of rights-of-
way acquired by the state under former 43 U.S.C. 932;
and providing for an effective date."
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 45(JUD)
"An Act providing that a person who grants certain
conservation easements to the state that provide
public access for recreational purposes is immune from
tort liability, other than gross negligence or
reckless or intentional misconduct, for damages to a
person who uses the easement under certain conditions;
relating to the vacation by the state or a
municipality of rights-of-way acquired by the state
under former 43 U.S.C. 932; and providing for an
effective date."
BRETT HUBER, staff to Senator Rick Halford was invited to
join the committee. He briefly reviewed the sponsor
statement for the committee. In referring to the judiciary
version of the bill he explained that it made a technical
correction to the statutes governing vacation of RS 2477
rights-of-way and section line easements granted under
former 43 U.S.C.932.
Senator Adams asked if municipalities would be liable under
this bill. Mr. Huber responded that the judiciary version
of the bill granted immunity to the landowners. There was
no immunity to the receiver. Senator Adams asked if the
50-foot width easement would hamper property owners? He
did not think this was enough easement. Mr. Huber briefly
responded. Senator Adams asked if a municipality vacated
an easement what would happen? In response, Mr. Huber said
he was familiar with the specific case that Senator Adams
was referring to and noted that the easement was a State
interest; and the Court found that this would take State
intervention.
Co-chair Torgerson asked Mr. Huber to explain the limited
tort. Mr. Huber said the conservation easement was a 50-
foot width. Anything else beyond the 50-foot easement
would be considered an illegal use. Some municipalities
would choose to deal with the easement rights differently.
Further, Mr. Huber explained that the easement could carry
other stipulations. Other groups, for instance, had also
suggested "lease".
Co-chair Torgerson asked if the bill could be expanded to
include University land? Mr. Huber said if the committee
so wished they most likely could expand the bill.
Senator Adams said he had an amendment to be presented,
which was being copied and therefore, Co-chair Torgerson
said he would hear public testimony at this time.
DICK BISHOP was invited to join the committee. He felt
landowners should have protection on their lands. He urged
passage of the bill.
NANCY WELCH, Regional Manager, Northern Region Office,
Division of Land, Department of Natural Resources testified
before the committee via teleconference from Fairbanks.
She referred to Section 4 of the bill and suggested
possible added tort immunity.
MAX LOWE, President of the Alaska Snowmobile Alliance
testified before the committee via teleconference from
Anchorage. He concurred with the bill and asked the
committee to consider its passage.
LANCE STEVENS, member of the Alaska Snowmobile Alliance
testified before the committee via teleconference from
Anchorage. He concurred with the bill.
BRYAN MERRELL, testified before the committee via
teleconference from Anchorage. He voiced some concern with
the bill and felt that private landowners would suffer
hardships. This bill and SB 180 should be reconsidered.
TIM BORGSTROM, Alaska Economic Development testified before
the committee via teleconference from Anchorage. He felt
Alaska should be consistent with other states. He stated
his support of the bill.
HARVEY HARRIS, testified before the committee via
teleconference from Glennallen. (testimony unintelligible)
MICHAEL EASTHAM, member, SNOWMADS testified before the
committee via teleconference from Homer. He was concerned
that trail users did not stay within the 50-foot easement.
He said that immunity should be extended. They supported
the bill.
DALE BONDURANT, testified before the committee via
teleconference from Kenai. He strongly supported the bill.
HOWARD DAVIS, Caribou Hills, testified before the committee
via teleconference from Kenai. He strongly supported the
bill.
TIM KRUG, City of Wasilla testified before the committee
via teleconference from Mat-Su. He said the City of
Wasilla strongly supported the bill.
TOM STAR, Mat-Su Motor Mushers testified before the
committee via teleconference from Mat-Su. He said he also
strongly supported the bill.
Senator Phillips commented briefly.
WALTER SAMSON, NANA Regional Corporation was invited to
join the committee. They supported the bill and would be
happy to answer any questions.
Senator Adams MOVED amendment #1. Co-chair Torgerson
OBJECTED. Senator Adams asked Carol Carroll, Department of
Natural Resources to join the committee to explain the
department's concerns regarding immunity. There was a need
for private owners to be protected.
CAROL CARROLL, Director, Division of Support Services,
Department of Natural Resources was invited to join the
committee. She noted that with the amendment #1 immunity
would be broadened. It would extend to the grantor and
grantee both. She said that the testimony this morning
indicated there was a need to broaden the immunity.
Co-chair Torgerson referred to line 14 of the amendment #1.
Ms. Carroll commented.
Senator Parnell asked if the particular language would
narrow the definition? Ms. Carroll said taken in whole was
the broadening of the immunity. She explained that this
particular language in amendment #1 was taken on the advice
of their attorney. Ms. Carroll said she would rather defer
to their attorney for any further explanation.
DICK MYLIUS, Department of Natural Resources testified
before the committee via teleconference from Anchorage. He
said he would try to answer any questions the members would
have. He explained the particular language in question,
"arising out of the use of" line 14 of the amendment #1.
He did not feel that a battery or assault charge would be
the concern of the landowner.
BRETT HUBER, staff to Senator Rick Halford was invited back
before the committee. He commented briefly to amendment
in this situation. Mr. Huber said the amendment would
expand the grantee to include other governmental bodies.
Senator Parnell asked for a definition of "other
governmental bodies"? Senator Adams said for instance, it
would include "municipalities and other state agencies".
Mr. Huber said the limiting factor would be at line 24.
Senator Green OBJECTED to the amendment. She said she
would rather go back to version "G" of the bill, which was
the original bill. Senator Adams indicated his amendment
would fit in either version of the bill.
By a roll call vote of 5 yeas (Torgerson, Parnell, Donley,
Wilken, Adams) and 3 nays (P. Kelly, Green, Phillips)
(Leman absent) amendment #1 was ADOPTED.
Senator Parnell MOVED CSSB 45 as amended and WITHOUT
OBJECTION it was REPORTED OUT with individual
recommendations and accompanying fiscal notes.
The committee took a brief at ease.
Co-chair Torgerson reconvened the committee and called SB
105.
SENATE BILL NO. 105
"An Act determining the facilities constituting a
school for purposes of public school funding; and
providing for an effective date."
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 105(HES)
"An Act determining the facilities constituting a
school for purposes of public school funding; and
providing for an effective date."
MEL KROGSENG, staff to Senator Robin Taylor was invited to
join the committee.
JOHN KIMMELL, staff to Senator Robin Taylor was invited to
join the committee and gave a brief commentary on the
sponsor statement. He apologized for the Senator not being
present saying he was in Washington D.C.
In response to a question by Senator Phillips, Ms. Krogseng
said the bill would affect only Petersburg and Wrangell
schools.
Senator Parnell asked about fiscal notes but Co-chair
Torgerson cautioned that perhaps the committee should hear
from the department. Ms. Krongseng responded regarding the
fiscal note. Petersburg will be in trouble if the bill
does not pass and the Wrangell school was in trouble last
year. She noted that the fiscal note from Department of
Education dated 4/22/99 was the correct one.
Senator Wilken asked if the schools were single site
schools. Co-chair Torgerson advised that they were.
EDDY JEANS, School Finance Manager, Department of Education
was invited to join the committee. He explained the fiscal
note attached to the HES version of the bill. He advised
the committee that the department opposed the bill. There
were problems as far as the department was concerned last
year with SB 36. There are districts affected by this
situation. Another school would be Dillingham.
Co-chair Torgerson query. Mr. Jeans reiterated that the
department was opposed to the bill and anything to do with
the foundation formula. He explained the adjustment per
school size depending on student enrollment. Mr. Jeans
said he would get actual dollar amount back to the
committee, in response to a request from Co-chair
Torgerson.
Senator Adams said he did not bring his amendments to this
bill. He noted problems with SB 36. Co-chair Torgerson
said he would always have time for any amendments from
Senator Adams.
Senator Kelly asked if there was any specific statistics
regarding Dillingham school and Wrangell school. Mr. Jeans
explained as best he could but indicated he would provide
further information to the committee.
Senator Phillips asked about the three-school situation in
Wrangell. Mr. Jeans responded that it would have depended
on the population at the time the schools were built.
BOB ZORICH, testified via teleconference from Petersburg.
MARY FRANCIS, Superintendent of Schools, testified via
teleconference from Petersburg. She explained the
projected enrollment for next year was about $350,000
difference between SB 36 and SB 105.
SHARLA COON, testified via teleconference from Petersburg
and said she supported the bill.
KAREN SEVERSON, testified via teleconference from
Petersburg and said she supported the bill.
ELIZABETH BACOM, testified via teleconference from
Petersburg and said she was concerned with cuts in
educational funds. The cost of education is not
appreciated until the student leaves the system. Education
should remain a priority for Alaskans. She supported the
bill.
TRACEY REID, testified via teleconference from Petersburg
and asked the committee to support and pass SB 105.
WOODY WILSON, Superintendent of Schools, testified via
teleconference from Wrangell. He explained the tragic
situation in their community and urged the committee to
pass the bill.
PAUL ANDERSON, Mayor pro tem, City of Petersburg, was
invited to join the committee. He said a commitment was
made last year to consider SB 105 upon the passage of SB
36. He said the situation was the same in Wrangell. He
explained cuts in the community due to deficit budget.
Everything has been closed down in their community. "Let's
get real and get our kids to the university."
Co-chair Torgerson said he would set the bill aside pending
receipt of information from the Department of Education.
SB 29, SB 133 and possibly SB 128 would be taken up
tomorrow morning.
ADJOURNMENT
Co-chair Torgerson adjourned the meeting at approximately
10:30 a.m. (Tape number 113, side B, log 255.)
SFC-99 (1) 04/28/99
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